SlideShowPro Account Center: User Forums

The fact that Flash is missing on the iPhone and iPad is Apple's loss, and not a reflection of any shortcomings of Flash.

Flash is a very powerful multimedia programming platform that gets better with every release. It's proven itself as a reliable and popular format, and when in the right hands cannot be beaten.

There's a reason why so many iPhone users, myself included, have jail-broken their devices. The reason is that so much of the potential features of the iPhone are locked down by Apple for reasons completely removed from the interests of the end user. And you think such restrictive tactics indicates that Flash is a "dead-end"? Please!

To think you can't even drag a video file from your computer to the iPad without first going through the tedious iTunes syncing process. No thanks.

The screen on the iPad is 1024 x 768 so most videos will be letterboxed. No multi-tasking. Feature lock-out, no basic USB transfer allowed to your computer, probably no video-out signal unless you're playing youtube clips, like on the iPhone.  I'll take a widescreen laptop or netbook or some other tablet over this "iPod Touch XL" any day!

Did you notice how Steve Jobs emphasised that you can have "any picture you like for your home screen". Um, Steve, wow man, you've really pushed the boundaries with that one! Seriously man, the world has moved on from customising one's desktop background. Apple iPad..... wait for it..... FAIL !!!

I have to agree with rwright730 here. I love ssp and director but after Apple's announcement of the iPad I'm just afraid that by building my photosite with ssp, a large amount of people are not going to be able to see my photo's anymore in the future!

This discussion has nothing to do with the iPad itself. Love it or hate it, fact will be that Apple is going to sell a huge amount of them (maybe not to more technical savvy users, but the common person who doesn't know a lot about computers are going to buy them massively).

This discussion has also nothing to do with the fact if flash is good or not. I like it (even as a heavy mac user) and I would really hope that it would become more widespread. But realisticly speaking, Apple is never going to allow it on iPhone, iPod Touch, iPad or whatever other product they bring in the future. And as such, building a website with flash will just ignore a huge market, which I really don't want to.

So yes, please indicate that you are at least exploring alternatives to flash!

thanks!
Peter.

I have the same concern as well. I heavily rely on director, ssp and slidepress on my website, and I would love to know that all the magic that director does could be done without a flash based ssp. Even a basic ssp without all the bells would be a relief.

I'm actually considering buying an iPad, I'm a photographer/videographer and the thing would be really nice to show my work to potential clients, but since the slideshows in my website are flash based, I would be showing my work offline... photos and clips living inside the iPad... that is, if there's no way to make director show the pics without flash.

Please.. please! consider doing an alternative ssp, all the magic (asset management) actually comes from Director anyway!

I'm glad someone started this thread. I love SSP, it's so easy to use and the results are fabulous. I've never been crazy about Flash, but then again I don't have anything bad to say about it either. But the reality is that Apple's iPad has changed everything - it will not include Flash and I can't rely on users installing hacks.

I woke up this morning with the realization that I really have to do the responsible thing and put two artist websites on hold until I can figure out an alternative to SSP. I can't design their sites and then have to turn around in a year or two and tell them the money they just spent was wasted as they have to pay me to redo their galleries using a different technology. (Worse case I'll just use old-fashioned HTML and CSS like in the old days, and give up the nice interface.)

PLEASE - the writing is on the wall. Whoever goes to market with a smart product akin to SSP but using technology that is iPad and iPhone friendly will clean up. I hope it's you guys.

Unlike others, I just don't know enough about Ajax and JS or PHP etc to do this myself. That's why SSP was such a godsend - the user manual was great for noobs, and you didn't even have to learn Flash! And once you have the look and feel going, adding more images to a folder and adding text to an XML file makes updates so easy for artist sites.

Last edited by crishdesign (2010-02-01 09:03:28)

Hi Gabriel, really like your site & photos - wonderful. regarding your mobile/noflash site - is the content being loaded from the same database, or is it separate ?

Thanks, Markus

how is that? have you developed your own solution or is there a plug in I am missing?

Thx, Markus

Whatever I personally might think about Flash and Apple, the pressure comes from my half of my clients already.

Some want to see their webpages on the iPhone and show photos from the gallery (actors, for example) and others plan to use the iPad for trade shows and also need to have full access with that toy to their web page.

So, if clients start complaining, all pro-cons discussions about flash are useless to me right now, I need a solution and start experimenting with connecting a Jquery javascript gallery to Director over php and the api. I am not successful yet but I see the direction.

yikes, bud.

Sorry about msg spam but here is one more thought for Apple fans (by the way I am Mac user too)...

Instead of posting requests in various forums (including this one) expressing your concerns about future of Flash on iSteve devices how about posting to Apple forums or writing directly to Steve himself asking him to SUPPPORT the Flash instead...

Frankly, I think this the way to go...

dreamdancer wrote:

^ That would be all well and good except that there are way more people blocking Flash than are blocking javascript. And I so totally disagree with you about the iPad, but that is a different conversation.  I have never been enamored of Flash, I have had to translate several Flash sites to html and CSS because someone was talked into stupidly using such a closed system for their entire site! I do like how it handles video, but for slideshows I have been switching to javascript. I would like to have Director's abilities to manage a slideshow combined with Ajax as others have mentioned. I don't mind having the Director interface in Flash, but people on every platform need to see the slideshow content.

I disagree 100% - but hey that exactly is the beauty of freedom of choice that not many people appreciate these days.

I have no problem with someone blocking Flash, or Java, or what-not or preferring to use one thing over other - however, I have serious problems with "nazi" attitude and brainless mass hysteria such as recent "OMFG Flash is Dead!" Long live HTML 5 - when reality check and facts are proving something completely the opposite...

dreamdancer wrote:

Flash is buggy and has loads of problems. It is an old technology that Adobe got from Macromedia and unless Adobe can perform some miracle it would be better for everyone if some alternatives to it show up soon.  Even though I love SSP, I know that visitors to my sites have had issues viewing the slideshows and not because they have an iPhone, but because they don't have the proper version of Flash and don't want to upgrade.

Buggy? So is EVERY other software out there including OS X, iPhone OS, Safari browser, etc... etc... There is no single software that can't be made better hence we are having regular updates with them all. I know plenty of people who still run IE6 and cant view number of non-flash pages properly - so what? They need to upgrade their browsers... Just like some need to update their Flash Players... VLC Player... Quick Time player... Acrobat reader... their OS etc...

If they don't want to upgrade its their problem not mine.

In short this argument is non-sense...

dreamdancer wrote:

Yes, there are quite a bit of issues with Flash, so going around and saying "It's so great, it's so great everyone must have it no matter what" is not an answer any more than running to Steve & begging him to support it. It's not like someone hasn't asked him [Adobe] already! The conversation has been had and the answer given.

Yes there are some issues... But there are issues with anything and everything out there... For example my Safari is repeatedly crashing when trying to run HTML5 based video. I have no idea why and I know I am not the only one... Site simply doesn't run, it crashes the browser or in best case it freezes on "spinning beach ball"...

I am sure update to both safari and HTML5 will fix the issue just like some issues will be fixed with Flash when next update comes...

dreamdancer wrote:

Flash has it's place, but I am so tired of how it is being used to take over my web experience with ads that cover the page I am trying to view to so many crappy visuals that guess what, I too put a Flash blocker on my browser!!!

Of course it has its place and it is here to stay and evolve together with Java, HTML, CSS, Unity etc...

By the way - regarding adverts - they existed before flash as animated gifs and they will exist in the future, perhaps as animated HTML5 - be happy you can block it today since maybe tomorrow you won't be able to at all...

Also, Steve is planing some huge advertising moves across the devices, mobile & desktop - there is even rumour that he wants to include advertising as part of OS X! (lets hope this is not true!)

Sooner we understand that all this bullcrap is one big game based on business politics sooner we will be able to set ourselves free and demand protection of the internet and most importantly protection of our freedom of choice!

Last edited by XXNephilim (2010-02-04 01:55:31)

Let's find a flash alternative. I love director, but I really hate a lot of things about flash. Still, Flash is great in a lot of ways. I could care less about the android or the iPad or even the "iSteve" arguments, I just want my clients to see what I want them to see, the way I lay it out...I prefer it to not be Flash, but right now that is my only option. I want someone to force the market to break so that something BETTER than flash is created.

Last edited by hmcconnell (2010-02-04 08:06:43)

Great post guys. I would like to see slideshow pro implement a non-flash version for us.

I see from looking at ssp on facebook, its possible to turn the facebook photos into an ssp slideshow so they should be able to reverse it easily. If we could use this along with swfobject we could have a suitable solution for flash/non users alike.

Thoughts?

XXNephilim wrote:

Short addendum to my previous post...

I am sure most of forum users over here are already familiar with this - but just in case - here is couple of videos that clearly demonstrates the reality, facts and most likely the future:

http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flashpla...1/popup01.html

and

http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flashpla...1/popup11.html

I can't see the future due to the fact that your links don't work.  But I disagree, it is Flash that is restricting us, it always has, that is why even though people were buffaloed into having flash based websites and nav menus that is changing big time. Even Adobe.com uses a javascript based menu system instead of the Flash one they used to have.

YouTube video plays fantastic on my iPod Touch so it isn't that video can't play well it is that the ad based sites can't program in the ads so easily. I was able to switch several of my image galleries to javascript and they play just fine and are viewable on all devices. The free script I got doesn't work off of an xml file, but there are ajax ones that do, so it isn't impossible to give users a different version of SSP in Ajax, I would pay extra for it.

Technologies always change, there was a time when almost every website was built with frames, not any more though. Frames have their uses, but for most sites there are much better methods now than there were. I am building a video library viewer myself using the Spry Data set in DreamWeaver. I have a site that has to function on everything including iPods and older computers that may not have the latest Flash player. I am posting the videos on YouTube and using the Spry Data set to bring up the video that is selected to be viewed. Not that different from using SSP except it plays on all systems. I am using YouTube since they automatically encode the video in all formats it saves me time, but in the future I will do that myself once html5 is more robust and ready to go.

Bottom line, Flash will have its place too, but I really get the sense it will not be growing but instead fading as better ways to present media evolve.

nice franz, tnx

Yes, I could really use one that worked with video.

It'll be awhile before I can set aside time to learn Director and enough PHP to get a new slideshow process going, but I really appreciate Franz taking the time to work on this as I really need an alternative.

macwise wrote:

Whatever happened to the PHP API?  I must have been mistaken—I was under the impression that it was built for precisely this reason: to give an alternative to flash based front end galleries.

Exactly. It's there. It works. Use it.

Lightbox seems to have the disadvantage that it needs to load all the thumbnails before the large images display properly. And if it doesn't work for the iPhone, just create your own gallery with a bit of HTML and PHP. It's not hard. At least for images, SSP have provided a sufficient mechanism for non-Flash alternatives.

Well, I think you can hang on in there. Certainly the API offers that route to continuing with Director. So even if you don't want to venture into the coding, I'm sure I'm not the only one who has been toying with the idea of adapting a slideshow web gallery so that it gets pictures from the API. I know the author, but we've only just started talking about it, so contact me offline if you want me to point you to his sample URL.

Last edited by johnbeardy (2010-02-12 12:39:20)

Cross posted from the lightroom thread:

tmcfadden wrote:

We don't have any intention of moving away from Flash.  As an iPhone user myself, I know the feeling.

I don't think anyone is asking SSP to move away from Flash, but it seems, more and more, like a dual Flash + Non-Flash path is the way to go.

Does SSP really want to shut out customers that want a flash alternative?

Obviously SSP has built their business on flash up until now, but the Web is going to evolve, as it always has, and though Flash may never die, it's dominance in interactive content may very well diminish, especially for "simpler" things like slide shows.

I think it would be in SSP's best interest to stay ahead of the curve, and offer an alternative, rather than keeping all their eggs in the Flash basket.

It seems that if SSP offered a simple and intuitive way for people to implement both flash and non-flash display mechanisms, deployed based upon the user's need on-the-fly, they can continue to be the premier slide show provider out there.

-mpm

Although devices not beginning with an "i" are supporting Flash. We shouldn't totally forget the elephant in the room....

And onto another aspect of this debate, I had a conversation with a client last friday about SSP and limitations for viewing Flash on iPhone OS devices, and he expressed grave concern that he wouldn't be able to manage his content via his iPad. I had really only looked at this from the aspect of the end user, not the content manager and/or site owner. But he was psyched that he was going to be able to manage the other aspects of his website (constructed with ExpressionEngine) using his iPad.

So I'm either going to have to come up with a dual presentation that he is happy with on his iPad, and by extension other iPhone OS devices, or look to another avenue to present his content. If it was a simple presentation--one album--I wouldn't be concerned. But we re looking at galleries with multiple albums and custom interface. And the most cost-effective way to get their is with SSP, not another custom method.

dreamdancer: thanks for the link, this looks promising!

btw, your link goes to a log-in page
here's the main page:
http://powergallery-demo.com/

For some of your customers (mainly Mac-centric who have Mac-centric clients), Flash IS dead. There's no way I'll ever design another slideshow that doesn't work on iPad. I don't care about numbers (which will be in the millions sold by the end of the year btw). If there are two solutions to a slideshow, and one will work on iPad and the other won't, guess which one will win out.

From your official statement: "Going forward, we want you to know that we intend to grow our business and expand our product lineup to provide alternate publishing solutions that aren’t reliant on Adobe, Flash, or any third party / proprietary technology for that matter. We’ve actually been quietly working towards that goal for a while now, and should soon have more tangible information to share with you."

Glad to see that there are business people in the house. I look forward to seeing what's in the works. I've been very impressed with the products and tutorials from SSP and I'd like nothing better than to support similar products that also work on iPad.

Last edited by crishdesign (2010-04-22 09:43:23)

"For some of your customers (mainly Mac-centric who have Mac-centric clients), Flash IS dead."

------

Errrmmm...

I am Mac centric designer with Mac centric clients and we are all loving Flash and it works rather awesomely on our computers!

iPad!?!?!

Pass

Well, I hope you are complaining to Apple, too - it's their fault.....